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<div class=3DSection1>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy=
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>The =
discrepancies
with some of the Taylor weights are for different reasons, and it is to And=
rew
Higson's great credit that he not only generously allows access to Taylor's
business archives for serious research, but also bravely permits the correc=
t
details to be published. Worcester Cathedral tenor is a case in point. Many
members of this list might have noticed that, while some details may be mis=
sing
from recent bell surveys, concise and correct details are now invariably gi=
ven
for Taylor jobs, and this reflects much credit on John Taylor & Co as a
company.<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy=
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'><![i=
f !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy=
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>The
differences in weights given for Gillett jobs between the tuning books and =
the
tower notice is a well-known phenomenon, and I believe that someone has
compiled a list. I have never seen an explanation for this, however.<o:p></=
o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy=
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'><![i=
f !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy=
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Chri=
s
Pickford's point about "exact" weights may be demonstrated in
instances where it is possible to compare "as supplied" weights w=
ith
"scrapping" weights. To give two examples, both weighed by Taylor=
s:<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy=
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'><![i=
f !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>Worsley, Lancs<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></=
p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'><![if !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p><=
/o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>Retuned 1912<span style=3D"mso-spacerun:
yes"> </span>Scrapped 1935<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'><![if !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p><=
/o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>1.<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">
</span>6-1-27<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">
</span>6-1-18<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>2.<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">
</span>6-3-25<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">
</span>6-3-16<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>3.<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </spa=
n>6-1-
4<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </span>6-0-18<o=
:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>4.<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">
</span>6-2-21<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">
</span>6-2-10<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>5.<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </spa=
n>9-0-
7<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </span>8-3-16<o=
:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>6. 11-1- 8<span style=3D"mso-spacerun:
yes"> </span>11-0-21<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>7. 13-3- 4<span style=3D"mso-spacerun:
yes"> </span>13-2-17<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>8. 21-0-14<span style=3D"mso-spacerun:
yes"> </span>20-3-11<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'><![if !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p><=
/o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>Walton-on-the-Hill, Lancs<o:p></o:p></span></fon=
t></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'><![if !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p><=
/o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>Retuned 1900<span style=3D"mso-spacerun:
yes"> </span>Scrapped 1953<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'><![if !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p><=
/o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>1.<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">
</span>4-0-25<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">
</span>4-0-21<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>2.<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">
</span>4-0-22<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">
</span>4-0-23<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>3.<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </spa=
n>4-1-
1<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </span>4-1- 1<o=
:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>4.<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">
</span>4-1-21<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">
</span>4-1-21<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>5.<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">
</span>6-0-21<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">
</span>6-0-16<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'>6.<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </spa=
n>8-1-
2<span style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </span>8-1-16<o=
:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy
face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.=
0pt;
font-family:"Courier New"'><![if !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p><=
/o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy=
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Whic=
h
would be regarded as "correct" as the weights of the old ring? In=
my
county "lists" that can be found elsewhere on Bell Historians, I =
try
to give details of the ring which preceded a "modern" ring. Where
available, I give the scrapping weights, but instances such as the above
present something of a dilemma.<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy=
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'><![i=
f !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy=
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Andr=
ew
Bull<o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy=
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'><![i=
f !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy=
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'><![i=
f !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3DEmailStyle19><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy=
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial'><![i=
f !supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]><o:p></o:p></span></font></span></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DTahoma><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:blac=
k'>-----Original
Message-----<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b> David Cawley
[mailto:dcawley@w...]<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 27 February 2005 17:18=
<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> bellhistorians@yahoogrou=
ps.com<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [Bell Historian=
s] Re:
Woodchurch etc</span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><![if !supportEmp=
tyParas]> <![endif]><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>I think
Chris's 'three points' deserve attention - though it doesn't solve the
Woodchurch problem; and Chris Povey's point about undrilled bells going thr=
ough
the hands of non-founding bellhangers after supply is a valid one.</span></=
font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>It is
when you come to "weights supplied with bells" and here are three
examples.</span></font><font color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-c=
olor-alt:
windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>WHITSTABLE
St Alphege Seasalter. On 1st August 1969 we took delivery from Whitechapel =
of a
ring of six bells complete with a tower record showing the tenor as 3-1-13,=
the
weight that has always been published. On August 19th the invoice was rende=
red
(<u>CB/33/69</u>) which included </span></font><font color=3Dblack><span
style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p=
>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><em><i><font size=3D2 col=
or=3Dblack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>"-From
metal provided from Tottington Church bells, casting a peal of six wit=
h
the Tenor 2' 0" in diameter, weighing C 3.3.1 and a total weight
of C 12.0.11. All accurately and harmonically tuned in the key of 'G'=
.
" </span></font></i></em><font color=3D=
black><span
style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p=
>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>The
total weight of the bells is that with the 3-1-13 tenor - was this a typist=
's
error or what? I have not examined the settings or tuning records=
.
All the other weights in the invoice - 15-1-17 of bells from Tottington,
12-2-17 for the existing church bell and 7-0-17 for the tubes - are all as
weighed in. I did not query it then as the total weight charged for was as =
set
with the 3-1-13 tenor. </span></font><font color=3Dblack><span
style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p=
>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>Two
archaic weights - 3-2-25 (1969: 3-2-5) for Tottington treble (JT 1851) and
12-2-23 for the existing bell are xplained by more accurate modern scales.<=
/span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>Next
one is G&J. We have already discussed St Nicholas Leicester (Tower reco=
rd
22.0.14; tuning books 22.0.0.; invoiced weight 22.0.14). But go to Tunbridg=
e
Wells, St Luke on <a href=3D"http://kent.lovesguide.com">http://kent.lovesg=
uide.com</a>
and see the significant discrepancies in each bell between what is in the
tuning books in Croydon library and what is in the framed record in the tow=
er.
It would be interesting to compare the exactly contemporary tower record of=
the
bells of almost identical size with the tuning records at Croydon.</span></=
font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>As
to JT&Co, Chris Povey pointed out the 'pencilling in' of the
Evesham record. Other examples have been identified. An interesting on=
e is
the ex-Bishop Latimer ring now at Perry Barr. The bells were cast in 1957 (=
5th
in 1904) and were received back in 1972. The weights recorded for the front=
six
show "Woodchurch" type discrepancies:</span></font><font color=3D=
black><span
style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p=
>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>Sent
Off Nett</span></font><font color=3Dbla=
ck><span
style=3D'color:black'> </span></font><font color=3Dblack><span
style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p=
>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>1957</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black'> </span></font><font size=3D=
2
color=3Dblack face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Aria=
l;
color:black'> 1972</s=
pan></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>4-0-6 4-0-7</sp=
an></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>4-0-26
4-0-25</span></font><font color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-colo=
r-alt:
windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>4-2-7
4-2-7</span></font><font color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color=
-alt:
windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>5-0-3
5-0-1</span></font><font color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color=
-alt:
windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>6-0-14
6-0-11</span></font><font color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-colo=
r-alt:
windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>7-1-16
7-1-13</span></font><font color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-colo=
r-alt:
windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>- &=
nbsp; 10-0-12</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>-
13-3-22#</span></fo=
nt><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
> </span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
># Note
says 'given later as 14-0-8'</span></font><font color=3Dblack><span
style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p=
>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>CJP and
I met at the Johnson on Saturday evening and I suggested that we might test=
the
accuracy of WBF/JT scales by sitting on each and seeing which side went dow=
n
furthest in each case!</span></font><font color=3Dblack><span style=3D'colo=
r:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>DLC</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<div style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm=
4.0pt'>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>-----
Original Message ----- </span></font><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=3DAr=
ial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;mso-color-alt:windo=
wtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;background:#E4E4E4;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:soli=
d black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><b><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>
<div style=3D'font-color:black'>From:</span></font></b><font size=3D2 color=
=3Dblack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
> <a
href=3D"mailto:c.j.pickford.t21@b..."
title=3D"c.j.pickford.t21@b...">CHRIS PICKFORD</a> </span></font>=
</div>
<font size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;f=
ont-family:
Arial;color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><b><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>To:</span></font></b><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=3D=
Arial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <a
href=3D"mailto:bellhistorians@yahoogroups.com"
title=3D"bellhistorians@yahoogroups.com">bellhistorians@yahoogroups.com</a>=
</span></font><font
size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-fa=
mily:Arial;
color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><b><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=
=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> Sunday, February =
27,
2005 7:25 PM</span></font><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;mso-color-alt:windo=
wtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><b><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></font></b><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
> Re:
[Bell Historians] Re: Woodchurch etc</span></font><font size=3D2 color=3Dbl=
ack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dblack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><![if=
!supportEmptyParas]> <![endif]></span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>Must be
brief - I'm supposed to be working to meet a deadline! - but I'd like to ju=
st
add a couple of points (apart from pointing out that Giles has mistaken me =
for
Chris Dalton)</span></font><font color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dblack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>I did
take the point made by Giles, even though it may not have been clear in my
answer, and I agree with him that this is nothing about history proper (i.e=
.
interpretation, use of evidence to make sense of things). It's simply about
documenting or recording what exists and here (to repeat what I said) the o=
nly
significance of a weight is as one element in a range of physical data abou=
t a
bell. </span></font><font color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dblack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>Others
(Mark Regan, for one) have already made the point on this list that Bell
History is a misnomer for what we do when we record and document the conten=
ts
of our belfries. But the fact that it isn't "history" doesn't mak=
e
the activity any less valid. We need an accurate record of what exists, and=
the
Woodchurch debate sits very comfortably in this context as we're trying to
establish what is the "correct" weight (not necessarily an accura=
te
one - even though this is the ideal)</span></font><font color=3Dblack><span
style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p=
>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dblack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>Andrew
Bull has helpfully stated that the key thing about recorded weights is that
they represent an actual weighing on scales - never mind the issue of accur=
acy
for a moment - at a particular point in time. For me, there are a couple of
main points:</span></font><font color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;
mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm=
4.0pt'>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:75.75pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;tab-stops:l=
ist 72.0pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0cm;mso-padding-a=
lt:
0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><![if !supportLists]><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=
=3DSymbol><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Symbol;
color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'>=B7<font size=3D1 face=3D"Times New R=
oman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> =
</span></font></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-fa=
mily:Arial;
color:black'>If a weight is quoted, I want to know the source</span></font>=
<font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black'> </span></font><font color=3Dblac=
k><span
style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p=
>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:75.75pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;tab-stops:l=
ist 72.0pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0cm;mso-padding-a=
lt:
0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><![if !supportLists]><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=
=3DSymbol><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Symbol;
color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'>=B7<font size=3D1 face=3D"Times New R=
oman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> =
</span></font></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-fa=
mily:Arial;
color:black'>If several weights are quoted at different periods, then I wan=
t to
know which is which (i.e. what weight was "current" at what date)=
</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black'> </span></font><font color=3Dblac=
k><span
style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p=
>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:75.75pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;tab-stops:l=
ist 72.0pt;
border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0cm;mso-padding-a=
lt:
0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><![if !supportLists]><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=
=3DSymbol><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Symbol;
color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'>=B7<font size=3D1 face=3D"Times New R=
oman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> =
</span></font></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-fa=
mily:Arial;
color:black'>If a discrepancy is found, then I want to try and establish th=
e
correct information by checking at source (and in the majority of cases thi=
s
produced definitive answers, at least with regard to "recorded"
weights)</span></font><font color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-co=
lor-alt:
windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm=
4.0pt'>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>On
Woodchurch, it's clear that there are two possible recorded weights - both
reliable in their way (and if the bell was weighed again, the result w=
ould
probably be neither 4-0-3 or 3-3-27, of course). As I've said, I hope that
Whitechapel can clarify. It may turn out to be a simple error in that the w=
rong
weight was entered in the book - but there may be another explanation. Nige=
l?</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dblack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'> =
;</span></font><font
color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-color-alt:windowtext'><o:p></o=
:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'=
>Chris
Pickford</span></font><font color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-co=
lor-alt:
windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto;
margin-left:39.75pt;border:none;mso-border-left-alt:solid black 1.5pt;
padding:0cm;mso-padding-alt:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dblack
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><br>
<br style=3D'mso-special-character:line-break'>
<![if !supportLineBreakNewLine]><br style=3D'mso-special-character:line-bre=
ak'>
<![endif]></span></font><font color=3Dblack><span style=3D'color:black;mso-=
color-alt:
windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
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