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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>My thanks to Peter Rivet for his input, which I have read
carefully and will take into account. It has certainly made me think...<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>>Peter Rivet wrote: <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>>“...</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>the same rules apply to faculty applications
as to applications for Listed Building Consent.” </span><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I’m not sure that I can accept this statement as a
generality and applying in all circumstances eg are local planning authorities
bound by decisions of the Court of Arches? Does the CofE faculty system have to
conform with the requirements of the Listed Building Act 1990 sections 7 to 9
regarding Listed Building Consent? (See <a
href="http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts1990/ukpga_19900009_en_1">http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts1990/ukpga_19900009_en_1</a>
- sections 7-9 and 60)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>>“...</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>Section 8 of PPG15 deals with ecclesiastic
exemption.”</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>The mention of PPG15 is useful (see PPG15 at</span><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>: <a
href="http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/planningandbuilding/pdf/142838.pdf">http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/planningandbuilding/pdf/142838.pdf</a>).
</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Charles Mynors knows about PPG15 because he quotes it in para.
50 of the Judgement ( See the Judgement at: <a
href="http://www.ringingworld.co.uk/pdf/Malvern_Priory_Judgment.pdf">http://www.ringingworld.co.uk/pdf/Malvern_Priory_Judgment.pdf</a>
). PPG15 states (at section 8.4 point 4) that when operating under the
Ecclesiastical Exemption “the decision-making body should be required...
to take into account... the desirability of preserving historic church
buildings and the importance of protecting <b>features</b> of architectural
merit and historic interest”. So why at paras 36,37 of the Judgement did
Charles Mynors not refer to it? Why did he choose to refer to The Listed
Building Act 1990 section 16.2 and force himself to try to accommodate the
Ecclesiastical Exemption? My guess is that PPG15 is actually just
“guidance” and not “Law” as such. Is it not correct
that the case in hand requires a decision based upon the Law, rather than on
advice from a Government department? If this is correct, then PPG15 might not
be admissible but The Listed Building Act 1990 could be used, provided that the
section referred to is applicable. (In this context Charles Mynors goes on to
discuss some further “advice” documents in section 50 to 54 of the
Judgement, although these are of little consequence to what follows. I’m
not sure why he put them in. Perhaps his local government background compelled
him? Perhaps he just lifted them from one of his books?)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>It might help to add the following 2 points to the earlier
posting:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>(i) In para 36 of his Judgement Charles Mynors is quite careful
about how much of The Listed Building Act 1990 Section 16.2 that he quotes. He
omits to mention that 16.2 starts by saying: “In considering whether to
grant listed building consent...”. He also omits the part that states
quite clearly that this clause only requires “the local planning
authority or the Secretary of State” to do something. Instead he
brings in the wording that the action is for “decision
makers” – an altogether broader term in the context in which it is
used. Now I do not know where the phrase “decision makers” came
from nor what legal validity it may have, but if we look back at the quote from
PPG15 above, we see that “decision-making body” is used there.
Could PPG15 be the source? I don’t know. (And yes, I have checked
sections 336 and 1 of the Town and Country Planning Act 1990 where the
interpretation of “local planning authority” is given; it does not
seem to cover Chancellors or “decision makers”.) <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>(ii) In the final analysis, the whole point of a
“judgement” is that it is something that “comes out of the
head” of a judge after bringing all of his or her legal skill and
knowledge of the Law to bear on the evidence presented. If during the formation
of that judgement the judge was “mindful” of something that
Parliament has stated should not apply, can we trust that he has performed his
task properly? <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>>...</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:blue'>operational needs of the congregation. This is to make sure
that the building remains viable as a place of worship. It's usually
seen as referring to issues involving the retention of pews and altar
rails.</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>As may be, but if the Law is correctly stated at para 56 of the
Judgement, then the conclusions do not seem to take it into account. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>The issue here seems to be all about “the views of regular
worshippers”. I would argue as follows. It is clear that pews, screens,
altar rails, seats, heating, organs etc. are the usual things under discussion.
The common factor between all of these is that they in some way relate to the
regular worshippers via their senses: sight, hearing, touch, smell and taste. (Yes,
think about it – all 5 might come into a high church communion.) Now
while the regular worshippers at Great Malvern finish their breakfasts or park
their cars on a Sunday morning, what is the first sense by which the church
reaches out to them? Yes of course it’s “hearing” via the
sound of bells ringing out as they have done since 1350 and probably before. Is
it not arguable that their views on the matter should be given particular
weight? <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>As before, I can’t claim that this is going to lead
anywhere, but I would be interested to know whether there is any validity in
these points. I’m happy to take responses off-list if it’s more
comfortable.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Chris Frye. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><u><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'> </span></u><span style='color:white'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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