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<font face="Times New Roman">As for the other initials, they could
well belong to the churchwardens. If the churchwardens' account
books don't survive for this period, try seeing if the parish
registers have been signed, or otherwise bear the scribe's or
clerk's name. Also research the families of people appearing in
the registers with the same initials - it could be that local
worthies paid for the bells.<br>
<br>
I suppose it's unlikely, but could the M of MC and the W of CW be
the same character, one of them accidentally cast upside down, and
one of the pairs of initials similarly reversed? More likely
though that one of the wardens was replaced.<br>
<br>
Lawrence Greenall, Waltham Abbey Historical Society.<br>
<br>
<br>
</font><br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 08/11/2017 16:15, 'Peter Rivet'
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:peter@plrivet.plus.com">peter@plrivet.plus.com</a> [bellhistorians] wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:001301d358ac$c2e98760$48bc9620$@plrivet.plus.com"> <span
style="display:none"> </span>
<div id="ygrp-text">
<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;">I’ve
had a quick look at Dennis Greenwood’s booklet on <u>Post
Reformation Bellfounders of York</u> (1994), which
contains a lot of useful relevant information. <o></o></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;"><o> </o></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;">William
Seller, the first of the Seller family of founders, is
reckoned to have worked c. 1635-1687. They generally
seem to have spelt the name Seller rather than
Sellars. It’s just possible that this is by him. His
early bells are generally found in Lincolnshire, which
suggests that during the mid seventeenth century he
was working there rather than York. However there’s
no reason why a bell from there shouldn’t have found
its way to County Durham, especially if it came by
sea.<o></o></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;"><o> </o></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;">Dennis
Greenwood comments that a noticeable feature of the
work of the 17<sup>th</sup>/18<sup>th</sup> century
York founders – the Smiths, the Sellers and the
Daltons – is that they arranged their moulding wires
(raised semicircular bands around the bell) in groups
of three. This may be a useful clue. <o></o></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;"><o> </o></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;">Peter
Rivet<o></o></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;">Lancaster<o></o></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;"><o> </o></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt
0in 0in 0in;">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;"
lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;"
lang="EN-US"> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:bellhistorians@yahoogroups.com">bellhistorians@yahoogroups.com</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:bellhistorians@yahoogroups.com">mailto:bellhistorians@yahoogroups.com</a>] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, November 8, 2017 2:11 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Bell Historians
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:bellhistorians@yahoogroups.com"><bellhistorians@yahoogroups.com></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Bell Historians] Fw: Bell
Identification, Dalton le Dale, St.Andrew [4
Attachments]<o></o></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o> </o></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o></o></p>
<div id="ygrp-mlmsg">
<div id="ygrp-msg">
<div id="ygrp-text">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;">[<a href="#TopText"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="text-decoration:none;">Attachment(s)</span></a>
from Carl S Zimmerman included below]</span></b>
<o></o></p>
<div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_67533">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span
style="font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;">The
attached inquiry is far outside my range of
expertise. I hope that a few of you might
feel qualified to reply to the inquirer.<o></o></span></p>
</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_67547">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span
style="font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;"> <o></o></span></p>
</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_67534">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white;"><span
style="font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;">Carl
Scott Zimmerman <br>
Saint Louis, Missouri, USA -<br>
- 19th c. home of at least 36 bell founders
or resellers <br>
Tel. +1(314)821-8437 <br>
Webmaster for <a
href="http://www.TowerBells.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">www.TowerBells.org</a><br>
* Avocation: tower bells<br>
* Recreation: handbells<br>
* Mission: church bells<o></o></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white;"><span
style="font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;"><o> </o></span></p>
</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_67538">
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_67537">
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_67536">
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_67535">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black;"><br>
----- Forwarded Message -----<br>
<b>From:</b> JEAN HAMILTON <<a
href="mailto:jeanhamilton@btinternet.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">jeanhamilton@btinternet.com</a>><br>
<b>To:</b> <a
href="mailto:csz_stl@swbell.net"
moz-do-not-send="true">csz_stl@swbell.net</a>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, November 8,
2017 7:50 AM<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Bell Identification</span><span
style="font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;"><o></o></span></p>
</div>
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_67541">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;"><o> </o></span></p>
<div id="yiv1487490267">
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_67540">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;">Hello<o></o></span></p>
</div>
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_67676">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;">I
am a member of Dalton le Dale
History Society
(dalton-le-dalehistorysociety.org
) Within our village we are lucky
to have a 12th Century church St.
Andrews.<o></o></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;">Recent
work on the roof allowed access to
the bell cote and photographs to
be taken of the bells. We are
subsequently interested in
researching their history and
would be grateful for any
assistance you can provide.<o></o></span></p>
</div>
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_67675">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;"><o> </o></span></p>
</div>
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_67674">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;">The
first reference to bells in St.
Andrews church was in the
inventory ordered by the Bishop in
1553: this included two bells in
the steeple, one hand bell and one
sacring bell. The next reference
can be seen within a plaque on the
south wall of the nave with the
date 1631 and four sets of
initials. Some of this information
is repeated on the tenor bell. The
raised letters are MC, ED, WS, and
IT, together with the date
1631.The initials on the plaque
are CW, ED, WS and IT. There is
therefore and anomaly between MC
and CW. We suspect the initials WS
may relate to William Sellars of
York who made bells around 17th
century. The initials MC could
relate to the vicar of the church
between 1621 and 1662 i.e. Matthew
Cooper. The national bell register
identifies the second bell as 14th
century but does not bear any
identifying features.<o></o></span></p>
</div>
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_67661">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;"><o> </o></span></p>
</div>
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_67544">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;">I
have attached photographs.<o></o></span></p>
</div>
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_68924">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;"><o> </o></span></p>
</div>
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_68857">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;">Many
thanks for taking the time to read
this.<o></o></span></p>
</div>
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_68925">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;"><o> </o></span></p>
</div>
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_68873">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;">Regards<o></o></span></p>
</div>
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_68858">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;">Jean
Hamilton<o></o></span></p>
</div>
<div
id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1510147404472_68859">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white;"><span
style="font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;"><o> </o></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white;"><span
style="font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black;"><o> </o></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:white;"><o></o></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
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