[r-t] Seven Deadly Sins

Robert Lee rlee5040 at yahoo.com
Mon Oct 31 19:15:02 UTC 2005

>Some answers for the as-yet unconvinced Rob Lee:
Not quite answers though Mark - still your views vs. mine!
>By using my
>program, you are using my algorithm, but that's no different from Ben
>Willetts, on ringing-theory, explaining to William Dawson, also on
>ringing-theory, how you calculate internal falseness, and William going away
>and using this new knowledge (algorithm) to produce compositions.
I'm still not happy with this. To my mind, an aid to composing such as a peal
prover or knowledge of internal falseness is different to a peal generator, 
in that one produces the composition and the other doesn't. You could be lectured 
on internal falseness until your ears bleed. This, on its own, will not result 
in compositions.
>Why should we regulate how those compositions are produced?
We don't have to, except maybe for some accuracy/consistency, depending on 
what your definition of composing is. To me, the logical definition (at least at grass 
roots level) is of producing a composition, whether it's done by a human, computer, 
monkey or spade.

>Neither would you have the compositions if you hadn't had the idea in the
>first place. You need both things to get the result.
Exactly, so credit the composition as "Me, using BYROC/SMC/whatever", as I
originally suggested. Just don't put "Comp: Me".
However, at the extreme, suppose you haven't access to a composition program, 
and you commissioned me to produce a composition for you in a standard method
including, say, Queens & some cyclical and little bell rollups. The original idea isn't 
mine, but I go away and work on it and find what I think is the most effective solution. 
Should I then give away/split the composition credit, just on the grounds that the 
original idea wasn't mine? If I did this, then I would indeed be a 'tool'.
>I don't want composition to be shackled to hand-generation of leads
>forever. There is a whole infinity of wondrous compositional possibilities
>waiting out there, ready for the plucking by the choosy and imaginative eye
>of the human composer, which will never be found if we restrict ourselves
Note that so far in this debate, I haven't condemned peal generators 
used in the right hands - my only query has been how we should describe 
the resulting compositions. 
PS. Robin, I wouldn't at all dispute that you composed the peal. 

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