[Bell Historians] Oldest set of six?

[Dickon Love]

Carl asks about the feasibility of recording and reporting on former bells and collections of bells. As he rightly says, Dove is focussed on what is in existence now, however in the background the Dove Team is able to record bells/collections that are no-longer in existence. This is an area for future development, both in terms of the design of the database, and the gathering of data. In the first instance we’ll be recording lost full-circle rings in order to drive the corresponding tables in the published book appendices. In time, it will be possible to grow this data set. However, as Carl says, the history of these things goes back centuries, with many unknowns, so we’ll never get a complete dataset. It is a huge job!

 

Dickon Love

Bromley, Kent

07983 352279

 

From: Bell-historians <bell-historians-bounces at lists.ringingworld.co.uk> On Behalf Of Carl S Zimmerman
Sent: Saturday, July 20, 2024 6:46 PM
To: Bell Historians <bell-historians at lists.ringingworld.co.uk>
Cc: c.j.pickford.t21 at btinternet.com
Subject: Re: [Bell Historians] Oldest set of six?

 

Chris's remarks prompt me to raise a related question.  While Dove Online constitutes a splendid inventory of existing rings and their component bells, and provides the basis for extensive statistical analyses of that inventory, how would one go about developing statistical analyses for earlier points in the history of change ringing, or for historical trends?

 

Such analyses are quite possible and practical for the histories of carillons and chimes in North America, because the TowerBells database describes each known present or former instrument in terms of the phases of its technological history.  Also, the total historical period is relatively short -- just over a century for traditional carillons, and less than two centuries for chimes of all types.  One example of the type of analysis that can be done is here:  http://www.towerbells.org/data/IXNATRyrHistory.html  (A lot more is possible; I just haven't gotten a round tuit!)

 

The situation is much different in the ringing world, where some records go back for more than four centuries.  County books undoubtedly provide partial snapshots as of their various publication dates, and surviving histories of individual towers.  What else can be done, or has been done, in the way of historical statistical analyses?

 

Carl Scott Zimmerman, Campanologist 
Saint Louis, Missouri, USA -
 - 19th c. home of at least 37 bell founders or resellers 
Webmaster for www.TowerBells.org <http://www.TowerBells.org> 

 

 

 

 

On Saturday, July 20, 2024 at 01:47:56 AM CDT, c.j.pickford.t21--- via Bell-historians <bell-historians at lists.ringingworld.co.uk <mailto:bell-historians at lists.ringingworld.co.uk> > wrote: 

 

 

Oldest SURVIVING ring of six. 

 

I always feel that such qualifying adjectives limit the true significance of such claims. By 1612 there were quite a lot of rings of six in existence (although in 1552 there were far fewer - but some) 

 

Important and interesting as a survival, but in the historical narrative Harwell's significance is minor

 

Chris Pickford 

Sent from my Huawei phone



-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [Bell Historians] Oldest set of six?
From: John Harrison 
To: bell-historians at lists.ringingworld.co.uk <mailto:bell-historians at lists.ringingworld.co.uk> 
CC: 

Richard

Thanks for the comprehensive answer.  In fact after Tim prompted me to
download data and do offline searches I downloaded all bells up to 1612 in
rings of 6+ into a spreadsheet and added a function to check each
place/dedication with the entry 6 rows above.  Only Harwell came through
that filter so not only does it have the oldest back six it also has the
oldest set of six.

-- 
John Harrison
Website http://jaharrison.me.uk
Using 4té and ARMX6, both running RISC OS

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